Exploring the philosophy and ramifications of antinatalism; that is, the belief that life should not be brought into existence.
Great video.I especially love how he pointed out that many of the things that make Westerners happy are dependent upon the immense suffering of others around the world. This is why I hate the phrase "as long as it doesn't hurt anyone." That phrase has no meaning generally and especially not in such a globally connected world.I can't quite call myself an anti-natalist (mainly because there are quite few people out there who seem to genuinely enjoy life no matter how meaningless and vapid it really all is and because I know that a lot of my problems with life aren't due to my own suffering but rather the suffering of others, I've had to learn the hard way that the suffering of others just doesn't affect most people the way it affects me) but I am a strong sympathizer to the cause.Keep up the good work. I love the discussions that go on here.
Some other good points are made regarding suicide in part 2 of that video.http://inmendham.com/dog/v085.html
Great video. The guy is a contemporary Socrates! His expressions when the English guy is spouting his self-serving crap are priceless:-)
Ooooops! Old monkey meant to post "Hey! Hey! We're The Humans."http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LubuSAgB5sI'm a little monkey and I've got a hat.
I really dig this guy. Not only is he a vocal antinatalist... he also extends his ethical concerns to the suffering of non-human animals. Here's a good one:http://www.youtube.com/user/SufferingSucks#p/u/5/9dL9Nng6uIg
He doesn't do the text/comment thing, either make a good video response or debate him in a chatroom he hosts on saturday night from 11:59.http://www.stickam.com/donotgodI also suggest you checkout his economics videos.http://www.youtube.com/user/FairEconomics
hhm the guy has his own encyclopediadramatica page ;)
I'm lost in all those blogs, Jim.I would like to talk to you about the fact we can see your picture and a David Jinkins' one (from my own website):http://nonprocreationday.free.frwhen we type on pipl (or Google France) "David Benatar"I only use firstname.lastname@example.orgAll the best,Stan (Paris)
More DoNotGod...DNA's irrational agenda. The ape and reptile brain (debate/response)Part 1 mp3 - 37 minutesPart 2 mp3 - 54 minutes
Hello fellow antinatalists,I just came across this surprising blog post on a Childfree blog:http://childfreedom.blogspot.com/2010/11/agent-smith-was-right.htmlThe argument is certainly nothing new to the antinatalist crowd, but it's interesting to note that some of these self-professed childfree folk might actually be antinatalists, as well. One of the commenters even mention's Benatar's book.-MM
Jim, is this you?http://www.godammit.com/2010/11/29/trash-truck/#comment-186723
TGGP: No, it isn't. I happened to see Sister Wolf's accusation on your blog, and already responded to it. At this point, I'm assuming she's misread an IP addy or something, and jumped the gun. Not a very responsible thing to do, but I'm not expecting an apology any time soon- though that would be a refreshing thing to see on the www.:)
The reason she thinks it's you is it's hyperlinked to this blog. Interestingly enough, on one of her entries from awhile back, she expressed anger at her mother for having her, so that she in turn would go on to have her son, who then killed himself such that she'd be left to mourn/suffer. I do feel bad for the lady, despite her aspersions toward well-meaning antinatalists and her failure to see the irony of it all.
Anonymous: Thanks for that 'hyperlink' explanation; I THINK I get it:) Anyway, Sister Wolf has sent along a screenshot in my mail, and lo and behold, it's NOT my email. Of course, anybody can have as many emails as they want, so I'm not sure how convincing that is.Let me be clear: I've never thought much about Sister Wolf, but never in my wildest dreams would I EVER use the death of her son as an opportunity to goad her. Furthermore, her attack on me was uncalled for, and basically shows more about what kind of person she is than anything I could come up with. Anyway, screw her, and on with the show. I hate this sort of shit. It's so infantile.
BTW, here's the comment I left on her blog, in case it never happens to see the light of day (comment moderation and all)...Sister Wolf: I suppose I should briefly respond to your false accusation, passed along to me by blogger TGGP. I don’t know why you’ve suddenly gotten it into your head that Hitler’s Mom is me, but I can assure you that you’re mistaken. As for the rest of the stuff, I always try to consider the source, you know? I am a parent as well, and am deeply sorry for your loss. I’m also not the least bit interested in baiting you; or, frankly, in much you have to say on any subject.When and if you discover the mistake you’ve made, an apology would be nice, though certainly not expected…jim
I don't think anyone should cut Sister Wolf any slack since she explicitly called anitalists "mentally ill". As Gary (DoNotGod)would say, "let's all just drink a Coke together and have a good cry".
Surely even the most cynical antinatalist should be able to muster up some empathy for her situation. Having lost her son in a very unfortunate circumstance, the tenets of antinatalism have become almost hauntingly prophetic. Indeed, her emotive outburst seems to be nothing more than a manifestation of that same hostility peculiar to philanthropic antinatalism that has been variously spouted from other thoughtless commentators. To therefore impose a negative judgement upon her would be to implicitly assert that she's anything other than a product of her flawed psychology. Honestly, you guys give her too much credit.
I don't understand why the troll is asking her to kill herself. One of us, sure, but why her? She doesn't advocate anything like suicide and she's not even an antinatalist.
I believe it's because she once told Jim to "get off the pot" and kill himself or something along those lines (majorly paraphrasing here). It was following a debate of sorts between her and some of our people (incl. Jim) on another forum. She was approaching antinatalism with the same blithe, poorly-thought out, dismissive arguments that have become well-worn and empty on our community's ears. She hit a bit close to the belt at times, IIRC, implying that we must be mentally ill, ya know... I'm guessing that's why Hitler took a nasty swipe, tasteful or not.
As much as I appreciate how this little tempest in a teapot is causing my hit points to soar, we probably should move on. Sister Wolf both libeled and slandered me on 2 public forums (it seems she's chosen to moderate my response on her blog into the nether regions), and I've answered with the truth of the matter. I suspect she's realized this by now, but being the cyber-narcissist that she is (and I'm not using this term loosely), public acknowledgement of her misstep is probably too much to ask. As anyone possessing a modicum of objectivity who's visited her blog should know by now, she's a particularly virulent personality who loves playing the martyr in the pursuit of self-aggrandizement. The fact that her terrible loss hasn't added any depth or humility to her musings is, perhaps, the most tragic aspect of all this. However, and lack of personal integrity on her part notwithstanding, I still feel sorry for her. Barring some new and interesting twist to this situation, I'm bowing out of this thread. On the plus side, I just got a new notebook with a built-in webcam, so maybe I'll start working on a video (if I can figure the thing out). Ain't technology grand?
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