Wednesday, July 18, 2012


I wanted to bring this comment up so nobody would miss it:

Anonymous said...
It is the greatest taboo to imply in any way that existence itself is not good, but evil. If you merely say people shouldn't have children for the purpose of reducing population size, so that people in the future will be happier, then no one will object (except for religious nuts). If you however say or imply that it would be better if life became extinct, then you are implying that our existence is bad in itself, that it can't be made better in any way. Then you are attacking, which Freud called the "Urvertrauen" (basic trust) in the basic goodness of existence itself and that's where you will encounter the strongest emotional resistance.

I guess this is what it's all about, really. I remember that, whenever I expressed doubts or regrets about the future, especially as they concerned our children, my wife would always say "everything will work out". We accept these little toss-offs so easily, precisely because we are so desperate for ANY little lie to negate what we know is true. I bought it, like most of us buy it, in the light of the evidence to the contrary which surrounds us.

I've been sitting here tonight, watching the video I posted below over and over again. Nothing I ever say here can surpass the earnestness of the speaker, nor the truth of his testimony. How many others feel this way, but keep it to themselves? Perhaps for most it never rises above an itch in the back of the soul, like a break in the skin scabbed over, but festering. The sense that something's wrong, something's wrong, what is it that's gone wrong? But if they ever say anything, they already know what they'll hear. "Nothing's wrong, dear. All's for the best." As a matter of fact, if they DO say anything, it's most likely in desperate anticipation of just such a response. Something assuring. Comforting. Something that takes the sting away. We've all been there, I think.

This 'urvertrauen', this basic trust in the goodness of existence, seems to me to be such a fragile thing when one considers the nature of the world as a whole; and yet, such a hard thing to be shaken. Understandable, I suppose. When you think about it, it's kind of a psychic suicide, isn't it; hope being the lifeblood of the spirit, and all? 'Where there's life, there's hope'. An interesting turn of phrase, that. A laudable outlook in the face of forces beyond our control, or merely descriptive of a pathological condition? Or both? Both in the short run, I think, but in the long run? Utter foolishness, especially as a justification for bringing new life into the world. Yeah, we don't have to lie down in the mud and die...not today, anyway. But eventually we'll all find ourselves there, face down, one with the muck, and no amount of bright-eyed optimism will change that. But we CAN change that future for our children, simply by not creating them in the first place. Shhhh...they'll never be the wiser.


Karl said...

Yes, the unspoken assumption is that 'Being' is at all times fundamentally Good. Evil, chance and suffering are somehow mere accidents and abberations. This is most pronounced in Theology, where Being is seen as a gratuitous gift from God, therefore to insult it or reject it is an insult to the Deity (hence making suicide a sin etc.).

On a related note, I came across this little spat. Watch a shameless utilitarian describe the Holocaust, Gulags etc as 'factoids', its victims as 'paltry millions' and so on. Sadly, this appears to be representative of the contemporary optimistic mindset.

Anonymous said...

I cannot bear hearing people say to me that "things will get better" or "it's all for the best" and so on. From birth I've been deformed and will be deformed until the day I die. There's no treating it. There is no real hope for any improvement, and believe me my family and I have sought medical help all my life. Help isn't availible for every condition in life. So when people say to me "everything works out in the end" or things like that, it actually hurts worse. I am far more comforted when people acknowledge the truth and the pain of my situation and the permanence of it. In my whole life I've not found anyone except antinatalists willing to do that.

Shadow said...

AN´s are far more caring and compassionate, honest individuals I´ve ever met in my life as well, Anonymous.

Good post Jim, keep ´em coming! =)

And yeah, I agree to every word here.

Even more so to that - We don´t have to lie down in the mud - not right now, at least. It seems the AN message is one of defeat, but it´s not, not anymore than acknowledging truth has to be. We do not have to become morbidly sick by recognizing truth - there´s no need to despair much. It won´t help anything, anyway. We gotta keep strong until the day, the final day comes. Until then, we fight.

Cheers to everyone else!

Karl! You put the link to Bitchspot´s AN rant! Did you like my defense there?


Apostate of Moloch said...

Big-O Objectivists (fake atheists) call it the Benevolent Universe Premise.

cuntagious said...

Antinatalism is the ultimate form of subversiness - quit breeding and put and end to this excercise in futility we call existence.

BTW, I started an antinatalism thread on the I Love Philosophy forum. It seems to have struck a nerve:

Anonymous said...

I'm loving when AN cracks the shiny veneer of mainstream media:

Anonymous said...

Not sure if this is the best place to put this, but there is an essay about future end of humanity here:

Seems like antinatalists are ahead of their time ;)

Sharkbabe said...

Hi everybody - this Onion piece is a keeper

Newborn Loses Faith in Humanity After Record 6 Days

(I was less precocious, think it took me three or four years :)

hope everyone's as well as possible

Leaving Society said...

Hello to Jim and his readers. I haven't been around these parts in a long time, and if you haven't been checking out my blog as of late, it was recently overrun by trolls during a pointless experiment that I undertook, but I'd like to point you all to my latest blog post, particularly the YouTube videos therein. I think that we really need to get the ball rolling on spreading the antinatalist message, so I ask that you give it a read and watch the videos if you're not too squeamish.

More of us need to start speaking about this publicly like the guy in the video that Jim linked to. Actually, I'd like to take that idea a step further and see if any of us can make our way into a lecture hall or set up a TEDx conference where we can run a PowerPoint presentation containing the important points alongside a few of the more harrowing nature videos out there. Maybe we can get people's attention if we focus on baby elephants more than our society's ills.

Just food for thought.

AntisocialMisanthropicPessimist said...

Try telling people that faith, hope and charity are vices. You get the same response.

I am not an anti-natalist - I'm a nihlist, and think that 'morality' is a broken herd animal heuristic that has the philosophic value of cold shit - but I have always found it comical how people take for granted the value of other people (as though adding up zeros will ever change the sum), their obsession with sex, children, and social relationships, etc.

I am a misanthrope, and while I could not give a flying fuck about retard 'moral' arguments, I do have to say I see nothing intrinsically attractive about the endless multiplication of nobodies and losers.